plumtreeblossom | So Very Wrong

So Very Wrong

Every single dating-strategies-for-men website or column I've ever read has been chock full of advice that would send this woman screaming for the hills or slamming doors in faces. I don't know who is writing them, but they sure don't know how real women respond to manipulative behavior and just plain rudeness.

I just took an online dating test for men, and I answered exactly how I, as a woman, would want a man to behave/act in each scenario. I failed the test! The answer key explained why.

Don't call/e-mail her for a week after the first date. Don't accept an e-mail address instead of a home phone number. If she won't kiss you on the first date, dump her; she's not interested. Use a homely woman to attract a gorgeous woman.

I am willing to wager money that no lesbian dating book suggests these things.

Every one of these would be grounds for dismissal in the very early stages of dating with me, with very few exceptions (if you get hit by a bus after our date, you don't have to e-mail me within a week of our date). I have to wonder what these date-flailing men who spend hundreds of dollars on books and "systems" to get more hawt babez think when some bitch like me says NO to a 2nd date after being told "You can reach the salt just fine yourself." In some cases I see multiple levels of material that the men have to continue buying to ensure success, but to sell it, the company has to ensure early failure. I don't see this bad behavior much in the poly community, but someone in the mono world is gettin' scammed.

I should get a panel of women together and write a real dating advice book for men. Advice directly from the intended target, not some aging Love Doctor who's arbitrarily (and profitably) decided that women put out for men (or women) who treat them like crap. I know otherwise. ;-)

(Working title: You Want A Date? You Can't Handle A Date!)

Heh, between me and my girls with dating experience, we probably have a collective 300 years of experience and advice to give.

I can remember personals ads dates where I was quite sure one of those strategic systems was being used on me. I wonder if they thought "WTF, I paid $200 for that set of dating tapes" while watching my backside exiting Starbucks.

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*Blush.*

but I love it when someone suggests an idea for a date.

how true! although i must say, i'm finding that it's quite exciting being the one suggesting things. makes me feel as though i've finally got a grip on this city that i must sadly begin to call mine. ALSO, because the last date idea went over so very well, i'm thinking i'm on a bit of a roll.

i'll let you know when i get sick of it. ;)

Oooooooh, yes. That's exactly right.

Stop trying to steal my friends.

j/k :-P

Observe this, men-who-date-women! No two women are alike in how we want to be courted, and there is no formula to win us all. Just like there is no one formula to win you all. :-)

This is worth writing/collaborating about. :-)

Yah.
Actually funny and productive.
http://www.vh1.com/shows/dyn/cant_get_a_date/series.jhtml

Gina Barreca, feminist humorist English professor and author of several books including "They Used to Call Me Snow White...But I Drifted", met them in person. I think she was on a TV interview/panel/thing with them.

They acted snide because she'd had a divorce and said, "We're both on our FIRST marriages."

She said, "Oh, yeah? Well, I'm on my LAST."

She's still married.

The Rules is pure loathesomeness. I had a relationship with someone once who genuinely believed it contained sensible advice, and even suggested once that she'd like to incorporate it into her own dating life. I told her that if that was her plan, her and my future was highly limited -- as indeed it proved to be in any case.

The Rules: ugh, ugh, ugh. My mom the incredibly cool English teacher used to teach a high school course on women's literature, and she analyzed The Rules in class as an affront to women everywhere. My mom rocks.

You are totally not just kidding :) You're just afraid I'm going to tell them embarassing stories about you, like the time in Cancun when you... ;-P (now I'm just kidding)

Jealousy is a very power human emotion is all I can say. I can't see myself using it as a tool for manipulation, but I can definitely see it working on me.

Yes, I too am aware that nice guys do get girls. I believe that I fall into the category.

I do believe that depending on one's age and other factors such as geography, the number of women available for nice men differs.

I also believe that it is harder for nice men to meet compatible women, like there's some invisible barrier that has to be penetrated. At least that's my experience. Once women realized I was of the nice guy type, they became much more attached.

This brings me to the final nice guy observation, in that trying to break up with a gril when you're a nice guy is very difficult. Once they realize you're a nice guy, they don't want to let go.

he could direct chi with his penis

Heeeeeeehehehehehee! I had one tell me he could "cure" me with his penis. The same one who said "Don't say you're not attracted to me. You just don't know you're attracted to me."

Does that blog still exist? I want to read it!!

I should get a panel of women together and write a real dating advice book for men.

Not that this is a bad idea, but does dating advice really have to be gender specific? I'd be more interested in a book about how men and women (in whatever combination) should take equal roles in the dating process!

exactly! i also think that it depends on the specific person. this person in particular is pretty laid-back and open to all kinds of activities (of the non-carnal kind, to my current knowledge. ;) ) and so it's less daunting to pick things. but yes, no rules, just... whatever works right.

This is worth writing/collaborating about. :-)
i've only ever dated two people, but i am willing to offer my meagre services, certainly, for the greater cause!

also, permission to quote part of the entry to a friend?

That icon makes me scream with envy!!!!!!!!

Sure, feel free to quote from any of it!

I'd like to see a book that talked to both genders at once. (And assumed that people of both genders were sane, intelligent, reasonable people who were both willing and able to take equal roles in the dating process.)

I think the advice does kind of have to be gender-specific, because the genders still do have a lot of gender-specific baggage and assumptions that have been imposed on them and whatnot and do tend to think of the other gender as Mysterious. (I assume those who date their own gender don't have so much of that latter problem. :) )

Note that I know basically nothing about dating, in the going-on-dates-with-someone-you-don't-know-well sense, because I have done this precisely once, in high school (with a boy I met taking the achievement tests). :) But it's an interesting topic for lots of reasons.

(I'm mostly reading this thread going "wow, not only are there really people like that out there, but people I know have actually met them..." Somewhat sheltered, me.)

The Rules are a bigger joke than Mission Accomplished.

I still can't get a date though. Weird. Anyway.

Oh and hey

mindflankr I think it was you who a long time ago asked me how to put in YouTube vids on your LJ- you just cut and paste the code YouTube gives you off to the right under the description of the vid.

*Returning you to your regularly scheduled Mare blog*

I do NOT understand why some girl hasn't scooped you up already. Somewhere out there there's a punk rock Catholic girl who likes beer and super-nice guys like you. It's a matter of finding her. Do you have any personals ads up? If not, I would totally help you write some, or if you do have some I could do some consulting to see if we can figure out why you're coming up empty-handed. Jimmy should not be womanless.

I think the thing men don't get is that we don't put up that invisible barrier against nice guys because we prefer bad boys. We put up the barrier because by the time a woman reaches adulthood we have had so many dickheads lie to us, manipulate us and generally be sleazy to us that at first we can't tell the difference between a nice guy and a jerk so we protect ourslevs until we feel like we can trust you. this is just the way life is. So instead of being frustrated with women go kick those guys who made us have ot act that way in the junk!

Punk rock girls.

Wait... who is this who needs a date!?

HOLDON! I *know* a hot punk rock girl who likes beer and needs a nice boyfriend! she's one of the coolest people I know. She's a devout athiest though. Is that a problem?

I'd love to go around kicking them in the gonads. I'm a professional martial artist -- I love kicking things.

I also have a lot of pent up anger against the bad boys/man-children of the Earth. Dating back into my teens, I've longed for the nice girl, and even been open about my feelings for her. I think of High School and College now. But her eye was often on the bad boy, the "artist", or the man-child, and a woman's lust is the most powerful force on the face of this Earth. You're swimming against the torrent in that situation.

Sadly, these same men still have no trouble attracting women into their thirties, with the same ruinous consequences for their female partners.

I've had the good fortune of knowing two of these men (the bad-boy and "artist") in their mid to late 30's. If it is any consolation, they often feel trapped by their own behaviour, unable to change as that is the only game they know, yet unable to form a committed relationship based on love and family.

So as much as I'd love to go around kicking these men (before they reach the age where the errors of their ways becomes apparent), I learned that women just have to make their own choices in romance, just as much as men have to choose the right woman for them.

Feel free to rant abot the misguided men who choose the bad woman.

I don't know if the Athiest thing is a problem (Jimmy would have to answer, but I KNOW he drinks on Sundays...)

Jimmy is a young old-school punk with a heart of pure gold (You'll see --< LJ user=jimmystagger>). You joined T@F too late to meet him, but he did tech for a few of our shows and won many hearts with his sweetness and coolness and love.

He needs a 20-or-early-30-something alterna-punk-chick with whom to raise alterna-punk-babies. He's ready, enthusiastic, family-oriented as only Irish-Americans can be, yet COOL and bursting with reasons why people who DON'T abdicate their personhood upon breeding should breed.

Well... the girl I'm thinking of is my sister. She's 24, briliant, an artist and designer, a RISD graduate, and in the last 5 years she's probably photographed just about every major Boston punk band from the mosh pit. And she does it all while looking cute.

I don't think she's ready to be raising punk rock babies.. but as many people know the guys in that scene can be assholes and she could use a punk rock boy who will treat her right.

The only drawback I can see is that if he's any less than perfect to her I'll have to kick him in the junk, and I do my best not to kick people my friends are friends with in the junk.

Plus, we might have to "accidentally" set them up because she might find it too dorky to have her lame older sister introduce her.

; )

As far as kicking guys in the gonads... i could give you a few addresses!

But really! For all the men there are sitting around wondering why girls like assholes, there are just as many girls sitting around wondering why nice guys fall for manipulative bitches. REALLY you never see through the most obvious mind games! Why does it only take one catty bitch to batt her eyelashes and get you hooked? What is it!?

Okay, okay, I admit I have gone for the badboy/ emotionally crippled man child thing a few times. I'm stll not 100% sure why I do it and I can't answer for other girls, but i have a few theories:
1) I'm terrified of falling for someone and settling down. If I only date jackasses then there's no danger of that. Also, I hate being hurt. If I date a douchebag I can just say, "he was an asshole" and move on easily when her screws me over.
2) We like challenges.
3) Sometimes danger= sexy. I think this is why boys go for crazy girls too.

Luckily I've discovered recently that underneath every good boy there is a bad boy lurking, and all it takes is the right girl to find it. There is nothing like having a loving and trusting relationship with a little danger thrown in for good measure!

Uhm, hi. I'm Jim. The punk rocker aforementioned. No I don't have any problem with someone being an athiest. I don't force my beliefs on others. I'm a lapsed Irish Catholic, which is to say I don't attend Mass and have problems with the Church but still consider myself part of it and try to live up to the parts I do like (service to the poor, living a good life, etc).

I'm a nice guy. Check out my myspace page for more on the man they call Jimmy Stagger

http://www.myspace.com/jimmystagger

or shoot me an email at knowyrproduct@netscape.net

I am not opposed to blind dates!

And thanks.

Oh and hey, I'm an older brother with two younger siblings I zealously over-protect. I undertstand the nut-kicking impulse and applaud it. As one older sibling to another, I'm OK.

I would really appreciate any assistance you could render me chief because I am bloody sick and tired of being single. Send me an email, I lost your #!

knowyrproduct@netscape.net

we'll get together for some beers at your casa, also so I can pet Skunky and Rowley!

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So Very Wrong

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Yes.

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Joyeous has friends?!?

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Re: 47 first dates

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